Pony with History of Grass Founder

My trimmer has been working with founder recovery for a bit.  I haven't really talked much about it with him but I'm sure he could give you some ideas.  I don't have his web site but if you Google Steve Johnson natural hoof dragonfly, you'll find him.  His farm in KY is something like Dragonfly farm but there's another one so you have to put in name, hoof stuff and you'll get to him.  I encourage you to email him!  He's on the road alot but will answer emails.  You might find some info on his web site.  Last I looked a pic of me and Bully was up there!  []

Hey Hunterseat, we have a fantastic farrier too.  He's due to come back in about 3 weeks for our other horses and donkey and by then Cupcake the pony will be due for a trim as well.  She had her hooves trimmed about 3 weeks ago.  Her rear hooves look great but if you look closely at the front ones you can see ridges and a little dip in the front.  Anyhoo I can't wait to get his opinion of her hooves and talk to him about shoeing her for the trails as well as his thoughts on her condition.  I'll also be calling our vet's office next week to get their input.
 
I just don't know how long she should be allowed to graze or if I should always keep her dry lotted.  Her previous owner said the founder happened a few years ago when they lived in Georgia and it hasn't happened since.  They allowed her to graze in moderation after she recovered.
 
I do know she's not a fan of her grazing muzzle.  She got aggravated yesterday and stood off by herself for quite a while pouting. LOL  But like all ponies she's a piggie and I know she'll eat until she's hooves in the air.  She's already got a little bit of a crest and a nice rotund belly.  She definitely could stand to lose a few pounds.

I needed to email Steve anyway so I asked him what he thought about the grazing.  It's always good to get opinions.  Founder is.... confounding!

[quote=RosieRox]
 Shetland pony
history of grass founder
 overweight.  
 
These three things point to a high risk of insulin resistance.   It would be a good idea to go ahead and have the vet run a resting serum insulin test on her to see if that is the case. And if so, to allow you to monitor how well you are controlling it with diet and exercise--basically it will give you a baseline number to compare future tests to.
 
 
 [quote=RosieRox] My plan is to dry lot her at night with hay and in the morning before I leave for work I'll turn her out with her muzzle on for the day and on weekends let her graze for a couple hours a day without the muzzle.  Does this sound ok?
 
I really would not recommend that much turnout with a grazing muzzle or not.   2-3 hours turnout is all that is recommended for horses with insulin resistance.  This pony would be better off dry-lotted all but a couple of hours per day and fed a hay low in non-structural carbohydrates.  You can send hay samples off to Dairy One Forage Lab for testing and you want a result that is no higher than 12%.  Warm season grass hays tend to be lower in NSC content that cool grass hays.   If you can't test your hay, you can soak it for 30 minutes in cold water prior to feeding to help remove some of the carbs.  

[quote=RosieRox]Also, in the winter should I feed her some grain as well as hay?  My miniature donkey gets about a cup of SafeChoice twice a day in the winter, would that be ok for the pony? 

 
Any horse that is kept mostly on hay needs a supplement to balance the vitamin/mineral content all year round.  I wouldn't go with Safe Choice (it's really not low enough in NSC's), rather choose a "ration balancer".  Many companies make them.  They are protein/vitamin/mineral supplements that are designed to compliment either grass hays or alfalfa.   They are fed at about a rate of 1-3 lbs a day for a full-sized horse, but you could contact the company that makes it to find out what would be appropriate for a shetland pony.
http://www.thehorse.com/pdf/factsheets/insulin-resistance/insulin-resistance.pdf

Thanks Ryle.  Our vet tech pretty much concurs with you.  I talked to her yesterday and she said dry lot only for Cupcake and no more than 1 hour of grass per day.  I'm keeping her in our barn lot behind the house (about 1/4 acre).  In the evening when I feed the horses I take her out to the round pen and let her graze for about 30 minutes and then keep the horses and donkey up here overnight so she's not alone all the time.  I give her 2 flakes of hay in the morning (last year's 3rd cut timothy/grass hay) and then they all get a little at night.  We'll just have to get in the habit of managing her differently than the others.
 
Purina makes a miniature horse and pony feed.  I'm wondering if that would be a good ration balancer for her.  I looked it up online and it's just vitamins and minerals and roughage.  Our vet tech hadn't heard of it, but was interested since she has a mini at home with a history of founder.
 
CORRECTION: Miniature Horse & Pony Feed is by Farnam.

I wouldn't put her out on pasture, either. I've never used a pasture muzzle, but I've had quite a few ponies, a couple of which were very aged and one that had had severe grass founder repeatedly in her life.
 
Dry feed, I wouldn't grain. I think two flakes a day of good hay should be about right for dry lot...but maybe not all at once? One in the morning and one at night? Hard to know without seeing the horse.
 
You'd think with all the specialized feed they have they'd make feed especially for ponies who founder.

Not too much to add besides what Ryle has written.... www.safergrass.org will give you some more tips on lami-prone horses. I wouldn't be feeding ponies or donkeys especially - but really any equine without good reason - grain or any high starch/sugar feed. I would however get them all onto a *good* complete supp asap. 'Ration balancers' can be good, but most seem to be grain based.

Exercise is so important for health. The more the better. So while I agree with Ryle & others who say to cut down on grazing, I'd be choosing a grazing muzzle & company over locking her up in a small yard if that's your alternatives. If it's possible to implement a 'paddock paradise' system that would be idea. Google it for more info.

Good hoofcare is a must. It is actually laminitis that is caused from too rich feed/metabolic issues. Founder is the mechanical state of the hoof that can arise from it. If you have a *good* hoof care practitioner who can trim the feet in an anotomically correct way, this will go a long way to avoiding full on founder in the future. However that's not to say you need to manage her to try to avoid/treat the laminitis too.

I agree with most of the info here.  I would not start soaking hay until after the pony has been tested for IR as it could skew your results.  Also,  Katy Watts (www.safergrass.org) still recommends soaking hay in cold water for at least 60 minutes, 30 for hot water.  She probably knows more than most vets and nutritionists about grass/hay and her site is invaluable to anyone with horses prone to or at risk for laminitis.

I'm happy to report that Cupcake has dropped some weight.  She was rather rotund when we brought her home.  She is doing well with our current arrangement of dry lot during the day with some hay, 30 minutes in the round pen grazing in the evening at feeding time and dry lot with the rest of the critters overnight.
 
The farrier is coming today and I'm very interested to get his feedback on her hooves.

Cupcake's hooves look beautiful now.  It's so amazing what a good, correct trim will do and compared to how the front ones looked before the trim, wow.  We didn't tell our farrier anything about her and he immediately said she'd foundered before, but that it wasn't too bad and it was a long time ago.  He was right, it was a mild case and it happened about 5 years ago.  We are so blessed to have him.  Dang I hope we never lose him.
 
Now that she's dropped some weight she's actually running around her little paddock.  All she could do before was a waddle-trot. LOL